Flat with smooth fibers implies formally smooth?Is there an example of a formally smooth morphism which is not smooth?Does formally etale imply flat?Why do we need finiteness conditions for formally étale morphisms?formally smooth => smoothDoes smoothness descend along flat morphisms?Spreading out flat morphisms of schemesIdea behind Grothendieck's proof that formally smooth implies flat?Formally smooth with smooth fibers but not smooth
Flat with smooth fibers implies formally smooth?
Is there an example of a formally smooth morphism which is not smooth?Does formally etale imply flat?Why do we need finiteness conditions for formally étale morphisms?formally smooth => smoothDoes smoothness descend along flat morphisms?Spreading out flat morphisms of schemesIdea behind Grothendieck's proof that formally smooth implies flat?Formally smooth with smooth fibers but not smooth
$begingroup$
Is every flat morphism of schemes $Xrightarrow S$ such that the fiber over any point is smooth necessarily formally smooth? There are formally smooth morphisms that are not flat so the converse fails. If we assume that the morphism is locally of finite presentation, then it is necessarily smooth so a fortiori formally smooth.
ag.algebraic-geometry
$endgroup$
add a comment
|
$begingroup$
Is every flat morphism of schemes $Xrightarrow S$ such that the fiber over any point is smooth necessarily formally smooth? There are formally smooth morphisms that are not flat so the converse fails. If we assume that the morphism is locally of finite presentation, then it is necessarily smooth so a fortiori formally smooth.
ag.algebraic-geometry
$endgroup$
add a comment
|
$begingroup$
Is every flat morphism of schemes $Xrightarrow S$ such that the fiber over any point is smooth necessarily formally smooth? There are formally smooth morphisms that are not flat so the converse fails. If we assume that the morphism is locally of finite presentation, then it is necessarily smooth so a fortiori formally smooth.
ag.algebraic-geometry
$endgroup$
Is every flat morphism of schemes $Xrightarrow S$ such that the fiber over any point is smooth necessarily formally smooth? There are formally smooth morphisms that are not flat so the converse fails. If we assume that the morphism is locally of finite presentation, then it is necessarily smooth so a fortiori formally smooth.
ag.algebraic-geometry
ag.algebraic-geometry
asked Jun 9 at 9:30
user141498user141498
add a comment
|
add a comment
|
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Welcome new contributor. This is too long for a comment. Let $R$ be a DVR with a uniformizing element $t$, e.g., $k[[t]]$ where $k$ is a field. Let $C$ be the $R$-algebra $$C=R[x_n:nin mathbbZ_geq 0].$$ Let $J$ be the ideal in $C$, $$J=langle x_n-tx_n+1 :nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ Let $A$ be the $R$-algebra $C/J$.
Since $A$ has no $t$-torsion, the $R$-module $A$ is $R$-flat. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R (R/t R)$ equals $R/tR$, which is smooth over $R/tR$. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R R[1/t]$ equals $R[1/t][x_0]$, which is smooth over $R[1/t]$.
Now consider the $R$-algebra $B=C/J^2$. Let $I$ be the image ideal in $B$, $$I=J/J^2.$$ This is a square-zero ideal whose quotient algebra equals $A$. Thus, if $A$ is formally smooth, there exists a retraction of $R$-algebras, $$s:Ato B.$$ In particular, $s(x_0)$ is a $t$-divsible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$.
Consider the quotient of $B$ by the ideal $$K = langle x_mx_n :m,nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ The quotient $B$-algebra equals $Roplus M$ where $M$ is a square-zero ideal that is the free, countably-generated $R$-module with basis $$ x_n : nin mathbbZ_geq 0 .$$ In particular, the element $x_0$ in this quotient algebra is not $t$-divisible in $M$. Thus, there is no $t$-divisible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$. Therefore, $A$ is not formally smooth over $R$.
$endgroup$
add a comment
|
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function()
var channelOptions =
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "504"
;
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
createEditor();
);
else
createEditor();
);
function createEditor()
StackExchange.prepareEditor(
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: true,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: 10,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader:
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/"u003ecc by-sa 4.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
,
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
);
);
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmathoverflow.net%2fquestions%2f333605%2fflat-with-smooth-fibers-implies-formally-smooth%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Welcome new contributor. This is too long for a comment. Let $R$ be a DVR with a uniformizing element $t$, e.g., $k[[t]]$ where $k$ is a field. Let $C$ be the $R$-algebra $$C=R[x_n:nin mathbbZ_geq 0].$$ Let $J$ be the ideal in $C$, $$J=langle x_n-tx_n+1 :nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ Let $A$ be the $R$-algebra $C/J$.
Since $A$ has no $t$-torsion, the $R$-module $A$ is $R$-flat. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R (R/t R)$ equals $R/tR$, which is smooth over $R/tR$. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R R[1/t]$ equals $R[1/t][x_0]$, which is smooth over $R[1/t]$.
Now consider the $R$-algebra $B=C/J^2$. Let $I$ be the image ideal in $B$, $$I=J/J^2.$$ This is a square-zero ideal whose quotient algebra equals $A$. Thus, if $A$ is formally smooth, there exists a retraction of $R$-algebras, $$s:Ato B.$$ In particular, $s(x_0)$ is a $t$-divsible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$.
Consider the quotient of $B$ by the ideal $$K = langle x_mx_n :m,nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ The quotient $B$-algebra equals $Roplus M$ where $M$ is a square-zero ideal that is the free, countably-generated $R$-module with basis $$ x_n : nin mathbbZ_geq 0 .$$ In particular, the element $x_0$ in this quotient algebra is not $t$-divisible in $M$. Thus, there is no $t$-divisible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$. Therefore, $A$ is not formally smooth over $R$.
$endgroup$
add a comment
|
$begingroup$
Welcome new contributor. This is too long for a comment. Let $R$ be a DVR with a uniformizing element $t$, e.g., $k[[t]]$ where $k$ is a field. Let $C$ be the $R$-algebra $$C=R[x_n:nin mathbbZ_geq 0].$$ Let $J$ be the ideal in $C$, $$J=langle x_n-tx_n+1 :nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ Let $A$ be the $R$-algebra $C/J$.
Since $A$ has no $t$-torsion, the $R$-module $A$ is $R$-flat. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R (R/t R)$ equals $R/tR$, which is smooth over $R/tR$. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R R[1/t]$ equals $R[1/t][x_0]$, which is smooth over $R[1/t]$.
Now consider the $R$-algebra $B=C/J^2$. Let $I$ be the image ideal in $B$, $$I=J/J^2.$$ This is a square-zero ideal whose quotient algebra equals $A$. Thus, if $A$ is formally smooth, there exists a retraction of $R$-algebras, $$s:Ato B.$$ In particular, $s(x_0)$ is a $t$-divsible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$.
Consider the quotient of $B$ by the ideal $$K = langle x_mx_n :m,nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ The quotient $B$-algebra equals $Roplus M$ where $M$ is a square-zero ideal that is the free, countably-generated $R$-module with basis $$ x_n : nin mathbbZ_geq 0 .$$ In particular, the element $x_0$ in this quotient algebra is not $t$-divisible in $M$. Thus, there is no $t$-divisible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$. Therefore, $A$ is not formally smooth over $R$.
$endgroup$
add a comment
|
$begingroup$
Welcome new contributor. This is too long for a comment. Let $R$ be a DVR with a uniformizing element $t$, e.g., $k[[t]]$ where $k$ is a field. Let $C$ be the $R$-algebra $$C=R[x_n:nin mathbbZ_geq 0].$$ Let $J$ be the ideal in $C$, $$J=langle x_n-tx_n+1 :nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ Let $A$ be the $R$-algebra $C/J$.
Since $A$ has no $t$-torsion, the $R$-module $A$ is $R$-flat. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R (R/t R)$ equals $R/tR$, which is smooth over $R/tR$. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R R[1/t]$ equals $R[1/t][x_0]$, which is smooth over $R[1/t]$.
Now consider the $R$-algebra $B=C/J^2$. Let $I$ be the image ideal in $B$, $$I=J/J^2.$$ This is a square-zero ideal whose quotient algebra equals $A$. Thus, if $A$ is formally smooth, there exists a retraction of $R$-algebras, $$s:Ato B.$$ In particular, $s(x_0)$ is a $t$-divsible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$.
Consider the quotient of $B$ by the ideal $$K = langle x_mx_n :m,nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ The quotient $B$-algebra equals $Roplus M$ where $M$ is a square-zero ideal that is the free, countably-generated $R$-module with basis $$ x_n : nin mathbbZ_geq 0 .$$ In particular, the element $x_0$ in this quotient algebra is not $t$-divisible in $M$. Thus, there is no $t$-divisible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$. Therefore, $A$ is not formally smooth over $R$.
$endgroup$
Welcome new contributor. This is too long for a comment. Let $R$ be a DVR with a uniformizing element $t$, e.g., $k[[t]]$ where $k$ is a field. Let $C$ be the $R$-algebra $$C=R[x_n:nin mathbbZ_geq 0].$$ Let $J$ be the ideal in $C$, $$J=langle x_n-tx_n+1 :nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ Let $A$ be the $R$-algebra $C/J$.
Since $A$ has no $t$-torsion, the $R$-module $A$ is $R$-flat. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R (R/t R)$ equals $R/tR$, which is smooth over $R/tR$. The fiber ring $Aotimes_R R[1/t]$ equals $R[1/t][x_0]$, which is smooth over $R[1/t]$.
Now consider the $R$-algebra $B=C/J^2$. Let $I$ be the image ideal in $B$, $$I=J/J^2.$$ This is a square-zero ideal whose quotient algebra equals $A$. Thus, if $A$ is formally smooth, there exists a retraction of $R$-algebras, $$s:Ato B.$$ In particular, $s(x_0)$ is a $t$-divsible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$.
Consider the quotient of $B$ by the ideal $$K = langle x_mx_n :m,nin mathbbZ_geq 0 rangle.$$ The quotient $B$-algebra equals $Roplus M$ where $M$ is a square-zero ideal that is the free, countably-generated $R$-module with basis $$ x_n : nin mathbbZ_geq 0 .$$ In particular, the element $x_0$ in this quotient algebra is not $t$-divisible in $M$. Thus, there is no $t$-divisible element of $B$ that maps to $x_0$ in the quotient algebra $A$. Therefore, $A$ is not formally smooth over $R$.
edited Jun 9 at 11:22
community wiki
3 revs
Jason Starr
add a comment
|
add a comment
|
Thanks for contributing an answer to MathOverflow!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmathoverflow.net%2fquestions%2f333605%2fflat-with-smooth-fibers-implies-formally-smooth%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown